Looking for advice on new wheels - IMBOC
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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-16-2017, 09:13 PM Thread Starter

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Looking for advice on new wheels

First let me say that in no way am I complaining about the wheels I got from Roy. They're what I wanted and I'm very happy with them. Neither of us knew there would be an issue and in no way should this reflect on him.

That said....

I bought those widened wheels he had for sale and after bolting on the fronts, I discovered they contact the struts. I put on a set of spacers (thanks Roy!) and that cured the strut rub, but 1 wheel still hit a strut bolt. So now I'm looking for some advice on what the best solution would be

1. I can add a thicker spacer. I didn't measure the ones I used but they appear to be 3/16. I think 5/16 would do it - do you think I need longer studs if I go that thickness? Any issues with running spacers over the long term?

2. Roy's running a degree of negative camber. I could skip spacers and go with camber plates but that's a lot more expensive and time consuming and no guarantee of working.

3. ???

Any thoughts? He said that Tigerhonaker ran similar wheels a while back - if this was on a stock suspension, did you have rubbing?

Sorry if these are dumb questions but I don't have a lot of car knowledge (but I'm trying!)
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-16-2017, 11:25 PM
 
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Maybe camber bolts might be another option, instead of actual camber plates? Less risk involved $-wise as opposed to plates. I also wonder if the bolts would give you even enough to not have to use the spacers up front at all?
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2017, 01:12 PM
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Using camber bolts for negative camber will actually hurt the tire-to-strut clearance. Plates will not affect it. Although negative camber really has nothing to do with the problem at hand; it actually addresses the tire-to-fender clearance. POSITIVE camber adjustment with a camber bolt will pull the tire away from the strut, but positive camber is generally a bad thing for handling.

Re: thicker spacer: rule of thumb is that if you can get at least 7 full turns on a lug nut, you don't need extended studs. Any less engagement that that is dangerous.

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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2017, 01:24 PM
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Hopefully you still have your original wheels?
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2017, 01:26 PM Thread Starter

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Originally Posted by pwd72s View Post
Hopefully you still have your original wheels?
Yes, but I hope to use the widened
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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-18-2017, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post

Any thoughts? He said that Tigerhonaker ran similar wheels a while back - if this was on a stock suspension, did you have rubbing?
I haven't looked in a long time, but I'm pretty sure Terry only widened his rear wheels; with the stockers anyway.

Jim

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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-19-2017, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post
First let me say that in no way am I complaining about the wheels I got from Roy. They're what I wanted and I'm very happy with them. Neither of us knew there would be an issue and in no way should this reflect on him.

That said....

I bought those widened wheels he had for sale and after bolting on the fronts, I discovered they contact the struts. I put on a set of spacers (thanks Roy!) and that cured the strut rub, but 1 wheel still hit a strut bolt. So now I'm looking for some advice on what the best solution would be

1. I can add a thicker spacer. I didn't measure the ones I used but they appear to be 3/16. I think 5/16 would do it - do you think I need longer studs if I go that thickness? Any issues with running spacers over the long term?

2. Roy's running a degree of negative camber. I could skip spacers and go with camber plates but that's a lot more expensive and time consuming and no guarantee of working.

3. ???

Any thoughts? He said that Tigerhonaker ran similar wheels a while back - if this was on a stock suspension, did you have rubbing?

Sorry if these are dumb questions but I don't have a lot of car knowledge (but I'm trying!)
See PM .....................


Terry

2008 Highland Green Bullitt Mustang, the "tiger-machine"


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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-19-2017, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post
First let me say that in no way am I complaining about the wheels I got from Roy. They're what I wanted and I'm very happy with them. Neither of us knew there would be an issue and in no way should this reflect on him.

That said....

I bought those widened wheels he had for sale and after bolting on the fronts, I discovered they contact the struts. I put on a set of spacers (thanks Roy!) and that cured the strut rub, but 1 wheel still hit a strut bolt. So now I'm looking for some advice on what the best solution would be

1. I can add a thicker spacer. I didn't measure the ones I used but they appear to be 3/16. I think 5/16 would do it - do you think I need longer studs if I go that thickness? Any issues with running spacers over the long term?

2. Roy's running a degree of negative camber. I could skip spacers and go with camber plates but that's a lot more expensive and time consuming and no guarantee of working.

3. ???

Any thoughts? He said that Tigerhonaker ran similar wheels a while back - if this was on a stock suspension, did you have rubbing?

Sorry if these are dumb questions but I don't have a lot of car knowledge (but I'm trying!)
Hi Kurt,

As it turned out PM's are limited in how many characters you can have.
My reply far exceeds that limitation so below is my Full Reply.



Kurt,

It looks like you are New to this INTERNET Site so you probably don't know me.

(That could be a good thing) LOL !!!

I answer guys in a Straight Forward Manner .........

That being said I'll tell you what I would do if it was my Bullitt Mustang.

Don't run the Stock (Modified/Widened) wheels up {Front}, Period !!!

Below are very informative links to exactly what I did years ago to mine.
I hope this helps with what your asking.

Modifying Inner-Fender-Wells for Modified 10" Wide Stock Wheels to "Fit"

Click on Link below,

1,021.81 Flywheel H/P, 817.45 RWHP, Video & Post # 9040



New Tires that are the Exact same ones that came on the GT500
Mustang.













Painted for 1-week underneath every Rusted place I could find. It
was so HOT I had to cover up to keep from Scorching my Legs on
Top and Bottom against Asphalt Driveway.

















Installed H&R Hub Centric 25MM Front & Rear Wheel Spacers.











The rear spacers go on with (No-Problem) & Wheels fit Great
But the Front Spacers fit okey but you have to "Cut" Off your
existing 5-Wheel Studs. They stick out to "Far". This is how you
should do the cutting. High Speed Dremel Tool W/Cutting Blade.
Look at this Pic and notice I left the Wheel-Lugs on next to the
Lug I was Cutting-Off. This way No-Messed up Threads.


Here are the Pieces that were Cut-Off. Notice they are different
Heights.


This pic shows the Finished Product. After cutting those Lugs off.
You have to then use the Dremel with a Grinding-Wheel. To make
all the Cut-Off-Studs as close as possible to the same (Length).
You, Do-Not actually Cut or Grind any of the (Threads). You are
only working with the end of the studs before you get to the
Threads. Takes time but (Not-Hard) to do.


I sent my 2-Back Stock Wheels to James at Weldcraft to have them
(Widened). They were 8.5" stock and they added 1.5" to make them
10" Wide. Shelby GT500 has 9.5" Wheels Front & Rear.
I know many of you are interested in this so you can retain the
Stock Wheels, so here are many Pics of the Widened Wheels.


























Here are the 2-Rear wheels Mounted & Balanced
This one took only 1-Weight


This one took 2-Small Weights


Here is the (Front-Side) of the Wheels as I removed them from the
Very-Well-Packed Box.
Notice, Not a Mark, Period !!!


Here are 2-Pics of the Box they came back in.
They were (Double-Boxed) and then had Bubble-Wrap.





If I can be of further assistance let me know,
Terry Honaker
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Last edited by tigerhonaker; 04-19-2017 at 12:52 PM.
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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-19-2017, 06:35 PM
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the wheels i sold him are 9 1/2" wide not 10" like you had.
they fit perfect on the front of my car without problems. i have read on other mustang sites you might need a 1/4", 5mm, spacers which i gave him.
the only problems i had is when i upgraded to BMR adjustable lower control arms. the wheels hit the reinforcements welded onto the control arms. i could have installed turning limiters in the steering rack to correct this problem.
i upgraded to brembo 4 piston calipers from a GT500 with 14" rotors. i could have installed 1/2" H&R hub centric wheel spacers and longer studs to correct this problem but i didn't want to go that route. this is another reason why i sold the wheels.
for the record i will be upgrading these brakes to Baer 6 piston extreme front brakes with 14" rotors shortly.
on the front end geometry i run 1* neg camber as stated above. i also run 9* positive caster, which is 2* more than stock. i am able to do this with the adjustable lower control arms and caster/ camber plates on the struts.

i can't figure out what bolt the wheels hit. my guess would be the sway bar links that connect to the struts. maybe just cut most of the hex off the stud maybe 1/2", and you should have clearance. with a little bit of the hex end still on the stud, there should be about 1/4" left, you can still put a wrench or a vice grip on it to remove them if you have to.
for the record i have tokoco adjustable struts up front and shocks on the rear. maybe this is why they fit on my car.


you could install these spacers, H&R 20mm DRS Series Wheel Spacers (5x114.3/70.5/0.5"UNF) for Ford , and they SHOULD fit without any problems. they have shoulders on them to mate with the wheel for more strength. the spacers i gave you don't have shoulders on them so they won't be as strong as these.
these spacers have the longer studs included, part of the reason for the higher price, so you don't have to buy anything else. you MIGHT have to use open headed lug nuts because of longer studs, or you could just let the studs poke thru the lug nut caps and trim off the bulged ends for a clean look.

also with these spacers you can install GT500 brakes with 14" rotors and they will clear the wheels.
with the stock motor and brakes you will still should pass tech with these spaces installed on most tracks, because you won't hit the speeds i do.


with the above novel written welcome to the real world of modifying you mustang. the more you modify the more problems like this will happen.
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Last edited by mrt2you; 04-19-2017 at 06:58 PM.
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-19-2017, 07:29 PM
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Hi Roy,

Quote:
with the above novel written welcome to the real world of modifying you mustang. the more you modify the more problems like this will happen.
Well stated and that is exactly the way it works and I definitely am speaking from personal experience ^^^




Terry

2008 Highland Green Bullitt Mustang, the "tiger-machine"


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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-19-2017, 09:52 PM Thread Starter

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Terry and Roy - thank you both for the responses. I appreciate the time.

Terry - You say not to run the widened wheels on the front. Aside from the obvious fit issue, is there any other reason? If spacers solve the problem, would you still recommend I not do it?

Roy - I just measured the spacer and it's 3/16. If I can get the car out of storage this weekend, I'll shoot a photo of the bolt that makes contact. I'm also planning to mock up a spacer with some washers to determine how wide I'd need to go to get clearance, and from that, determine if I would need longer studs. If it ends up I do, I'll likely leave the original wheels on the front until I have another reason to disassemble the hubs.

And after 20 years of old house restoration, dealing with the car is a nice change. Beats the hell out of crawling under a 120 y/o house to pull romex.
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-20-2017, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post
Terry and Roy - thank you both for the responses. I appreciate the time.

Terry - You say not to run the widened wheels on the front. Aside from the obvious fit issue, is there any other reason? If spacers solve the problem, would you still recommend I not do it?

Roy - I just measured the spacer and it's 3/16. If I can get the car out of storage this weekend, I'll shoot a photo of the bolt that makes contact. I'm also planning to mock up a spacer with some washers to determine how wide I'd need to go to get clearance, and from that, determine if I would need longer studs. If it ends up I do, I'll likely leave the original wheels on the front until I have another reason to disassemble the hubs.

And after 20 years of old house restoration, dealing with the car is a nice change. Beats the hell out of crawling under a 120 y/o house to pull romex.

Terry -
Quote:
You say not to run the widened wheels on the front.
Aside from the obvious fit issue, is there any other reason?
If spacers solve the problem, would you still recommend I not do it?
I was (Referring) to the Width I had my rears widened to !!!
(I ran the Stock Bullitt Wheels up Front with Wider Tires)

I read what Roy said he had his widened to and from what he posted he had no (Fitment) issues.

So, you ask and here is my thoughts.
(I'm now referring to if it was my Bullitt)
If I could run the small spacer that I used in the front and the Front-Widened-Wheels Roy had will work using those thin front spacers then all should be A-OK.
If I (Personally) had to run thick spacers up front to use the Widened Front Wheels then I would NOT run them I would simply use the stock wheels up front.

I'm saying what I would do and like many things on Modifying/Changing things we all many-many-times have completely different opinions.

Keep in mind that some of the things I do and don't do are based on the POWER level of my Bullitt which generally speaking does not play a roll with the Majority of other Bullitt Mustangs.

For a Stock Bullitt Mustang I think you can do many-many things completely different than I will on mine.

Hope the above helps some,
Terry

2008 Highland Green Bullitt Mustang, the "tiger-machine"


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Last edited by tigerhonaker; 04-20-2017 at 11:19 AM.
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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-22-2017, 02:06 PM Thread Starter

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Fixed

Short version: I'm an idiot

Long version: The bolt that rubbed was the sway bar link bolt. Using a die grinder, I took it down about 1/8". Using the 3/16" spacers, I remounted the wheels and 1 side was perfect while the other side still rubbed. Come to discover that it's wasn't just rubbing the bolt, it's also rubbing the strut housing itself. Kinda SOL on that one unless I use a thicker spacer. I take the wheel off and then, just for the hell of it, decide to swap front & rear. Was thinking that -maybe- there was an oddity to the tire and the rear would fit better. I do this, and sure enough, the wheel fits just fine - no rubbing at all. I can even get the tip of my finger into the gap that wasn't there before.

Then I look at the tire sitting next to me (the one that rubbed on the front). It's a 285/40-18.

The one I just took of the read and moved forward is a 275/40-18.

What I thought were 4x 275/40's are actual 2x 275/240's and 2x 285/40's and I had them mixed up.

Now, with the correct tires on the font and rear, everything is fine.

So if you ever encounter a similar issue, make sure the wider tires are on the back
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-22-2017, 03:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post
Fixed

Short version: I'm an idiot

Long version: The bolt that rubbed was the sway bar link bolt. Using a die grinder, I took it down about 1/8". Using the 3/16" spacers, I remounted the wheels and 1 side was perfect while the other side still rubbed. Come to discover that it's wasn't just rubbing the bolt, it's also rubbing the strut housing itself. Kinda SOL on that one unless I use a thicker spacer. I take the wheel off and then, just for the hell of it, decide to swap front & rear. Was thinking that -maybe- there was an oddity to the tire and the rear would fit better. I do this, and sure enough, the wheel fits just fine - no rubbing at all. I can even get the tip of my finger into the gap that wasn't there before.

Then I look at the tire sitting next to me (the one that rubbed on the front). It's a 285/40-18.

The one I just took of the read and moved forward is a 275/40-18.

What I thought were 4x 275/40's are actual 2x 275/240's and 2x 285/40's and I had them mixed up.

Now, with the correct tires on the font and rear, everything is fine.

So if you ever encounter a similar issue, make sure the wider tires are on the back

i wouldn't worry about it to much.
i have done dumber things than that.
i didn't look that close at the tires. when i sold them i thought they were all the same size. i didn't put those tires on the car, the previous owner did.
i took the tires off and put them in storage 2 days after i bought the car. i installed 4 piston brembo brakes off a gt500 and the rims wouldn't clear the brakes.

glad to hear everything is fine now.
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-23-2017, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post
Fixed

Short version: I'm an idiot

Long version: The bolt that rubbed was the sway bar link bolt. Using a die grinder, I took it down about 1/8". Using the 3/16" spacers, I remounted the wheels and 1 side was perfect while the other side still rubbed. Come to discover that it's wasn't just rubbing the bolt, it's also rubbing the strut housing itself. Kinda SOL on that one unless I use a thicker spacer. I take the wheel off and then, just for the hell of it, decide to swap front & rear. Was thinking that -maybe- there was an oddity to the tire and the rear would fit better. I do this, and sure enough, the wheel fits just fine - no rubbing at all. I can even get the tip of my finger into the gap that wasn't there before.

Then I look at the tire sitting next to me (the one that rubbed on the front). It's a 285/40-18.

The one I just took of the read and moved forward is a 275/40-18.

What I thought were 4x 275/40's are actual 2x 275/240's and 2x 285/40's and I had them mixed up.

Now, with the correct tires on the font and rear, everything is fine.

So if you ever encounter a similar issue, make sure the wider tires are on the back
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2you View Post
i wouldn't worry about it to much.
i have done dumber things than that.
i didn't look that close at the tires. when i sold them i thought they were all the same size. i didn't put those tires on the car, the previous owner did.
i took the tires off and put them in storage 2 days after i bought the car. i installed 4 piston brembo brakes off a gt500 and the rims wouldn't clear the brakes.

glad to hear everything is fine now.
Well guys,

It reads like all is now A-OK !!!

Good deal ..............


Terry

2008 Highland Green Bullitt Mustang, the "tiger-machine"


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